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Restoring Wharrams

A place for those restoring any Wharram

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Latest Activity: Jul 15

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Tabernacle

Started by Dave Mundy Apr 6, 2015.

Adding pods to 'classic' Wharrams. 9 Replies

Started by Pete Rigby. Last reply by david duval-hall Aug 11, 2012.

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Comment by sarah on May 4, 2009 at 1:51am
Hi guys, I got my Tangaroa out of the water in one piece! there are pics on my page, it was really scary.... now the work begins!
Comment by Bill Ludeman on March 23, 2013 at 2:10am

I am not sure where the best place to post this but it is IMPORTANT.

I posted it on my page but it seems to me that the restoring group might be the best place so here it is again.  

I had my boat safety checked by the US Coast Guard Auxiliary - it was free and they also don't turn you in for major violations.    I made every effort to "Pass" the inspection.     THE ONE BIG THING IT TURNED UP was very important.    I did not have an HIN or Hull Inspection Number.    Something that has been overlooked for 30 yrs with no trouble.   My boat was sold by the builder and purchased by another fellow who then sold it to me.    By the letter of the law we all committed crimes.    Argh!     I had no idea nor did anybody else.    I read the Florida statute and freaked out.     I also read up on this - It is a Federal requirement and the rules have change several times since my boat was built.     My boat now has an HIN clearly marked so is stone cold legal.   I have looked at many  older home built boats and this has never come up.  I don't know if they do or do not have HIN's but now that our government has HomelyLandsickurity in charge of the waterways it is for sure smart to go check on it and make sure you're legal.   The law says that ANY law enforcement officer can confiscate and impound your boat until its proven that you legally own it.    In other words they can take your boat and charge you for storing it while the guvmint sorts out whatever.  SInce mine has a thirty year history and has been registered in three states it might take them forever to sort it out.   Scary stuff.      I have taken steps to further backup the legality of my boat.    I hate to sound like a scaredy cat (pun intended)  but this stuff terrifies me. 

The other interesting thing that I turned up was that the USCGA inspector glanced at my type 3 MSD and said its a Portapotti.    I showed him the rating on it and he said oh don't worry its ok to have a portapotti.    Very worrisome - it is a standard looking potti but has the needed stuff to pipe thru the deck and a pump out fitting.    He also argued I would have to have a Y valve to be legal.   Now here is a guy who simply has not read the various rules and he is inspecting boats.    He passed me but taught me that if it looks like a portapotti it is probably going to have to be PROVEN that its a type 3 MSD.   So I printed out ALL the info on it including the US Coast Guards regulations and put them all in a zip lock next to my MSD.    Glad I found this out before it made me eligible for a misunderstanding resulting in a ticket.   One of my neighbors in the anchorage was threatened with a 5,000 dollar fine!?!?   Dunno if they can do that but don't want to find out.     

So the "free" USCGA VSC or Vessel Safety Check ordeal is over and it was well worth finding out about.   It turned up two problems I did not know I had and allowed me to fix them gracefully.     I would encourage anyone in the US to go ahead and get one and pay attention to what the inspector says.    Hope this helps - Bill and Tang in Palatka Fl

Comment by Iain & Cherry Mae Cairns on March 23, 2013 at 4:07pm

Thanx for the info Bill, does this include boats travelling to the US or just US registared boats. 

Iain & Cherry

Comment by Bill Ludeman on March 23, 2013 at 7:58pm

I don't know if this is for all boats anywhere?   If you  have paperwork from your country and a US cruising permit I would assume it would be ok to not have an HIN from your country.   I did read discussion on a US Coast Guard website about problems with other countries issuing HIN's that were close enough to the US issued HIN's that they had a problem and the discussion indicated that worldwide we should consider going to a 17 digit HIN indicating country of origin first.    I would check with what passes for the boating authority in your country for sure.   Maybe a phone call with no specific details <grin>  I believe the EU uses a similar system to the one the US uses.   I did find out that the Coast Guard will issue HINs for builders who produce very few boats.  Maybe one?    

When I read the penalties and realized they treat you as guilty first It really worried me.    I am awaiting a notarized statement from the builder on a US Coast Guard builders form.    I just got my antique vessel sticker today!

On this issue it seems that a few questions in advance could save a lot of trouble later.   If you plan to cruise in the US you might want to ask the USCG first.    Hope this helps  Bill SV Tang

Comment by Galway Bay on March 24, 2013 at 8:58pm

Yes this is important. It would be well worth posting on the main forum as it raises many questions and even here not many will see it.

In EU the HIN is the CIN .But it was only first issued in 1996 and exempt boats [inc. home-builds] do not have it.

I suspect in your case it is an age thing. You said this boat is 30yrs old? I doubt if the US were issuing HINs in 1983 ? Check it out ! Are home-builds exempt ?

But plenty of serious issues here. There was here on this site recently a well known boat for sale only a year or so old. USA built for sale EU. As I understand it not only will tax have to be paid on the sale but a complete set of papers ie. RCD. Cert. etc are needed even a user's manual is required.....

Comment by Bill Ludeman on March 24, 2013 at 11:45pm

I don't know how to post on the main forum, maybe it could be a regular subject, is that what you mean Galway?   Since our boats tend to be scattered around the world the legalities are a bit shifty.  I got a kick out of contemplating an owners manual.  Ok that end is the front...   That is UP and so on.    Most Wharram owners wouldn't pay much attention anyway, too busy plotting and scheming the next upgrades.   Grin.  

On the specific laws on HIN in the USA they have changed several times since Nov 1st 1972 as I understand it.   Prior to 72 an HIN was not required, then any boat US or imported had to have one.  My boat was built between 1977 and 1983 the completion year.  However the registration indicates it was first registered in 1985 - the year of the title is 83.   This is important because it is smack in between the first changes in HIN rules.    Before August 1st 1984 all boats built or imported into the US had to have two identical HINs.    And Catamarans should have  one on the aft crossbeam within one foot of the starboard hull   That statement was ALL boats in the US.

Then after August 1st 1984 one of the numbers has to be hidden inside the boat in an unexposed location... 

So since my boat was completed in 83 and titled as an 83 but shows the year of 1985 in its assigned Hull number it neatly straddles the rule change.    What is stunning to me is that it survived for 30 yrs in the US without any of it.    All fixed now.

Here is a reference website

http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknowhow/hin.html

and here is the USCG boatbuilders info page

http://www.uscgboating.org/regulations/boat_builders_handbook_and_r...

There is a mindboggling amount of info on this but the first one seems to cover what we need to know. 

Please know that the issues of documenting a boat are different and I don't know much about that.

If somebody wants to start a Wharram legalities or something section that would be good.   I think.    I am going to post some pictures on this topic sometime in the next week or two.   Bill - SV Tang

Comment by Galway Bay on March 25, 2013 at 4:38am

Wow - simpler to navigate Cape Horn than some of the paperwork out there. I have found the site you mention, boatsafe.com before. The stuff there always seems to be good and clear.

For posting Discussion - go to Forum either by clicking on the header at top of page or opening Any discussion. At top right click on  +ADD beside your name. [ you must be logged in ].Page will open.

For photos - if you add these to your page they automatically appear also on the slideshow on the main page.

Comment by Herr Kaluent on June 7, 2013 at 2:39pm

Some of our beaches [Cornwall] may not allow the use of logs as 'wheels' [ala neolithic constructions methods...], but some long flat planks with guide strakes affixed and liberally coated with fat [don't use mineral grease; we have to think of our environment - always...], would assist, again depending upon the incline of the beach.  I would use a winch to haul or 'kedge' her up the slope, perhaps one on each hull, its slow, but safe and would minimise any likelihood of damage to the keels [...remove the rudders beforehand, if need be.]

This is one of the main reasons why I aspire to eventually owning by own cat [hopefully an Island 65 or maybe an old Pahi 63], because when you want to dry out and chill for a short or prolonged period, you don't have to worry about stability or legs etc...  Get her high enough up the beach [preferably on a tropical island...] and one could use a cat as a semi-permanent base. 

Comment by dan on August 2, 2015 at 6:30pm
Anyone ever replace the steel brackets in the trough style beam design as on my 1970s naraiMKIV 42?

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