Free Discussions

[Budget Boater]

I started this site so that Wharramites, as I like to call us, could freely talk about their builds, the designs, and exchange information without the hassle of the other forums out there. I grew tired of having to wait on the administrators to answer questions and approve photos. They also would not allow links, would edit posts, and then delete entire posts or forums that they did not agree with.

I promise not to do that to you here. Controversial subjects are not taboo here. However, stay in good taste (no nudity, or extreme profanity please) and if you are stating your opinion, say so. If you have facts about something, be sure to add that information to your posts. If you heard something from a friend of a friend, say so.

Feel free to post your photos and materials, and videos and links to your website. Create your own groups, customize your personal page, and enjoy the site. You can make posts about things that you are selling so long as it relates to boating in some way. If you are selling one of something, please be sure to make a follow-up post when you have sold it.

Those that are not building Wharrams are also welcome here, we just ask that you are building a wooden boat especially if they are multihulls.

Shane

[Budget Boater]

I have not been able to figure out a way to add a counter. Sorry.

[thomas w deane]

nice day "wakataitea" said:

"...the designs are far from perfect..." that's right. the market and the "wharram sailor " changed in the last years. not a lot of people want to spend there half life building a boat and when they are ready to sail, they are to old to life like a rabid on a boat.
there is nothing wrong with lashing a boat together with ropes. the design has proofed it's sea worthiness a lot but the space concept (open space plan) is a kind of a joke. time has changed and nobody is shitting in a bucket anymore. the women on board wants a nice galley, the crew here privacy...
i thing wharram is pushing his designs a little bit to much into the professional boat building merket.

speak for yourself i still prefer shitting in a bucket. as to putting up with dumb heads with more holes in hull. and holding tanks too expensive to install and to pumping them out at inconvenant times.and to yupies that need desinger kitchens instead of galleys.every one to his own not everybody is the same. and it seems the simpler it is apeals to more.

[Dave Vinni]

It is interesting that all the major problems of cruising boats seemed to have been resolved by Wharram.

You have a boat that sails upright. It is easily driven so needs a smaller sail plan. Has no or little need for underwater skin fittings so electrolysis is not a worry. The rudders lash on so no worries with worn or corroded pintles. The rig is lashed and low tension so the risk of failing swages and bottlescrews is removed. A porta potti takes care of polluting harbours and does away with holding tanks. No diesel motors in the hull so no smell of diesel or wet bilges. A boarding ramp takes care of getting the dinghy on board and there is good storage space for a hard dinghy - it also makes it easy to get in and out of the water. The hullls take the bottom easily so that cleaning the bottom with a broom is a doddle. As well a being able to do maintenance and anti fouling. The V'd hulls and canoe sterns are very sea worthy.

But best of all they sail so well!

No I am not really biased....

Dave

Jacques said:

Well said,

The minimalism in Wharram designs is really what attracted me into it. Building myself, respecting the architect and understanding that there is a kind of "philosophy" behind it, I really feel like the genuine Wharram builder in the "amateur" sense.

[Ralf]

"but the space concept (open space plan) is a kind of a joke. time has changed and nobody is shitting in a bucket anymore. the women on board wants a nice galley, the crew here privacy..."

The women Iwould want on board is an able sailor not a galley slave. I can cook myself well enough and I can do it in cooking facilities that are suitable for a 30ft boat. What wakataitea is talking about has nothing to do with Wharram or not Wharram, it is more about what lifestyle you want onboard your boat and what size of boat you want and want to pay for. Clearly a 30 - 35 ft boat with a 'nice' galley which includes refrigeration, runing warm water and the large water tanks to suport that ,oven, a seperate bathroom with warm shower, toilet, inboard diesel, standing headroom, high freeboard, is not a sailboat but it is a motorsailor. If that is what one wants ok, but not me.
There are many desigs out there, just choose annother if the Wharram style is not for you.

I think there is more privacy in the 2 seperate hulls than in any monohull of the same length.

the woman who cannot shit into a bucket or a porta potti for that matter like I do will have some other problems, too sooner or later..... am I looking at a single handed future?

What is one attracted to in a Wharram design if it is not the philosophy of simplicity behind the designs anyhow?

[Pete Rigby]

Ralph,

In my opinion, your post is a magnificent expression of the Wharram philosophy. JWD should, [ and would], if he remembers his roots, applaud you.

Very best wishes,
Pete Rigby

[marc]

Hi to all
I'am happy to meet other people building wharram boat.
I'am currently in the process of drawing pieces on the wood before cutting. Not a hard work but quite a lot of time.
I don't know if it will be 5%, 10% or 20% or more of building process.
May I ask a question ???
Is there someone who has CNC files for wharram boats and can give (not sold) them.
We build traditional boats with modern technologies, why without modern methods. I love my jigsaw but ...
It seems to me that JWD doesn't offer that sort of support and that other people sold kits ; but a kit is not very easy to carry on every continent.
Maybe this forum could be a repository of open CNC files ???? Marc

[SChapin]

First off, many thanks for this space. And whatever I can do to ease the frustration of other builders, as I myself get into a muddle and hopefully out, I will. I am just now in the initial stages of trying to understand the Wharram (t30) plans and 'system'. Not easy for me as it's odd at first to fathom where which dimension is coming from... or going to. But I'll get it eventually. It seems some key information is off in some other booklet or corner, or not anywhere. So be it. I will probably offer up some inane ideas to the forum, forgive me, but I will try to contribute none the less.
Cheers,
Schapin

[Brian Gartland]

I think the reason that "official" Wharram websites and dealings with JWD leave a bad taste in some people's mouth is the disconnect between the Wharram philosophy and the idea of commercialism. I understand that JWD is a business and needs to make money, but, when the point of Wharrams seems to be the offer of an escape from commercialism, such a strict adherence to it seems hypocritical. I still remember the first time I went to the JWD site and how excited I was to learn about these boats, the stories behind them and the dream of a lifestyle they seemed to offer. I also remember immediately going to the online store to purchase plans and the bottom temporarily falling out of the dream when I saw the price.
I still shit in a bucket. Sometimes even on land.

Budget Boater said:

I think the "Flexi-Space" concept is unique in that you can more simply make modifications in interior arrangements without actually changing the structure of the boat. Hence, you can have a modified Wharram, without it actually being considered a modified Wharram. I think the Flexi-Space idea is Wharrams way of giving you liberties with interior design, even though this may not be what was originally intended.

Personally, I do not know why Wharram would care if myself or anyone else built his boats professionally. I never asked to be certified, approved, or endorsed by Wharram to build the boats. I just happen to be a boat builder that loves Wharrams. My clients tend to be those that want to home build, but soon realize that they either cannot do it themselves, or don't want to. They don't want to have their boat built in Asia, or understand that the exchange rate with the dollar is strong right now. Further, what I do is a service only. I write contracts that protect both myself, and the client - They own all materials all the time. They pay me monthly to "assemble" the parts for them. If a client decides they want to finish the boat themselves, they simply come and get the boat and remaining parts that they have already purchased. They get the benefit of being able to purchase materials at a discount, and have me build on a month-to-month basis.

I have a CNC table router that I cut all of the parts with (I did not start this way.) Because the CNC cuts accurately to within .003", I have had to redraw all of the parts in the computer and can easily offer precut boat kits. I wrote to Wharram as a courtesy to inquire about creating some kind of indicator that I could verify when someone (that wants to purchase a kit from me) has actually purchased a set of plans so that I was not offering kits to people without plans. I know that it would be just about impossible to build a Wharram without plans from one of my kits, but that would not stop some people from trying. Can you imagine the hack job that would look like? I do not know why they have their panties in a bunch. I do know that because of me, they have sold at least 4 sets of plans in the past 12 months that otherwise would not have been sold.

[boatsmith]

I have heard many times that some folks are of the opinion that JWD charges an exorbitant price for their plans. I snooped around on the web today and found these prices.
Wharram Tiki 30 $1040
Woods Windsong $1082
Hughes 30 cat $1800
Farrier F82 $1900
Horstman 30 $500
Not an all inclusive list I know, but it does seem that Wharram's prices compare well with many other designers plan prices.
On the other hand they do not design the most contemporary designs out there, but the sea hasn't changed much in the past few centuries,pollution excepted. I really like the molded toilet seat that fits a 3-5 gallon bucket. David www.boatsmithfl.com

[Ann and Neville Clement]

We have a porta potty on Peace and it seems ok until you try to lift it up to empty it. That thing is HEAVY. But there is a way to make your 5 gallon bucket a better option. You can buy a specially made fitting for your 5 gallon bucket that separates the liquids from the solids so long as everybody sits down. The liquids can be safely poured overboard because they are sterile and the solids can be dried in the bucket using solar energy. Computer fans run on 12 volts and can run off your batteries which could be solar or wind recharged as we do on Peace. Fitting a hose to the side of a bucket with a fan inside to exit the air in the bucket could be vented overboard along with the smells resulting in dried poops which do not weigh much at all. Some dried seaweed from the beach in with the poops would help too. Then just dig a hole ashore and plant some seeds for flowers or trees. That would leave a benefit instead of a problem in the water. We hope to have this set up on our boat soon. Ann and Nev

boatsmith said:

www.boatsmithfl.com

[Joe Swetish]

This sounds like an affordable alternative to the Air Head Dry Toilet I was considering. Where would I obtain the required fittings?


Thanks!

Joe

Ann and Neville Clement said:

We have a porta potty on Peace and it seems ok until you try to lift it up to empty it. That thing is HEAVY. But there is a way to make your 5 gallon bucket a better option. You can buy a specially made fitting for your 5 gallon bucket that separates the liquids from the solids so long as everybody sits down. The liquids can be safely poured overboard because they are sterile and the solids can be dried in the bucket using solar energy. Computer fans run on 12 volts and can run off your batteries which could be solar or wind recharged as we do on Peace. Fitting a hose to the side of a bucket with a fan inside to exit the air in the bucket could be vented overboard along with the smells resulting in dried poops which do not weigh much at all. Some dried seaweed from the beach in with the poops would help too. Then just dig a hole ashore and plant some seeds for flowers or trees. That would leave a benefit instead of a problem in the water. We hope to have this set up on our boat soon. Ann and Nev

boatsmith said:

www.boatsmithfl.com

[Ann and Neville Clement]

We have the info somewhere aboard Peace. If you can "hold your water" for a little while, we will look around and find it. Trouble with Peace is that she has so many places where things can get put away... Ann and Nev