Tiki 30 mast measurements

[Zach Johnson]

In planning out my Tanenui build I see that to accomplish my goal of open, unobstructed deckspace I'll need to use the Tiki 30 rig. The 30's rig is listed as an alternate Tanenui wingsail application, but JWD didn't include plans on how to accomplish the 30-rig implementation. They also haven't responded to messages requesting this info, at least as of this writing. Does anyone have Tiki 30 rig plans that they'd be willing to share?

Cheers,

Zach

[Budget Boater]

Zach,

They are not going to respond. If you want the T30 rig plans for the Tanenui, you have to purchase them since it is a upgrade to the design, not a standard option.

Here is the link: https://www.wharram.com/site/catalog/building-plans/classic-designs...

[Zach Johnson]

BB,

I had the intention of building a wingsail'd Tanenui from the outset so I purchased both the boat and wingsail plans. The confusing part of the sail plans was that the Tanenui wingsail plan view gives two rig layouts. The standard Tanenui rig, and the T30 drawn and noted as an alternative. The T30 rig carries the caveat of needing wider beams to re-establish the original stability due to increase sail area, but carried the benefit of moving the mast onto a main crossbeam. It also doesn't require a longitudinal beam for the mast, thus allowing increased open deck space, a significant plus for me.

Hanneke responded and explained that although the T30 is presented as an alternative, she "would advise against this." She also stated that she thought it "possible to place the mast for the smaller [Tanenui] rig on the actual crossbeam...like for the Tiki 30 rig. I doubt that this would give any problems with sail balance." This was my main goal of using the wingsail rig so I'll be shifting the original mast forward and adjusting the rig to suit.

[Budget Boater]

So you paid for the upgrade, but it does not detail the rig dimensions or what is required for the beams to support it?

If so, it sounds like JWD owes you some money back...

[Zach Johnson]

It includes the detail for the standard Tanenui rig. So all seems to be well there. The confusion came from JWD's unexpected inclusion of the T30 rig they don't suggest using. It seems prudent for them to edit that drawing and remove the T30 rig if it is truly not recommended for use.

Even after JWD's input, I'm still kicking the T30's rig around in the back of my head. I'll have to run the numbers on the required beam to support that pressure. If the additional beam is not going to cause an issue once the boat is assembled (I'm not certain as of yet to how the beam plays into marina math), then I may press JWD a little harder to get those "alternative" dimensions. That extra ~60sqft of sail (most of which looks to be at the top) would certainly help move the girl along.

Cheers,

Zach

[Budget Boater]

The Tanenui and Tiki 30 have the same weight, and the Tanenui has a standard beam of 12'6" while the Tiki 30 has a beam of 16'4".

As for the "marina math" I cannot help since I don't use marinas, so never consider what they might charge.

[Zach Johnson]

It would sure be nice to go with the Tiki beams to get the extra deck space. That will be some serious room once the mast is up on beam 2. I'll get the homework done this week.

I wish I could just just go straight to leaving it on the hook once completed... Alas, it'll be a lake boat until I can get it down the Tennessee River into the Gulf. I'm liking the idea of doing the lower section of the Loop - up to the OBX anyway. I'm getting ahead of myself though; I haven't even gotten the timber squared away yet!

[boatsmith]

More beam and more sail are plus more room sounds like the path to true enchantment to me. If the Tanenui is well balanced on the original plans then moving the mast forward will move the center of effort forward as well. This would cause lee helm. It would also shorten the foot of the jib which would result in a skinnier, more pointy topped jib which is also less efficient. Just my thoughts.

[Zach Johnson]

Leaving the sails shaped as originally designed and simply shifting the mast position would do as you say for sure. While I won't be able to do anything about the deficiencies created with the jib's shortened foot, I'm planning to resize the main to correct the lee helm problem.

[boatsmith]

add a sprit. I personally won't use the gaff wingsail again. The stock T30 rig was in my opinion too small for the boat. 

never once did we reef. several times in 35-40 apparent wind speed.  

[Budget Boater]

I think that most Wharram sailors consider that a positive benefit of the design. For light air performance I added an 8' pole connected to Beam 1, which was used for setting light air sails to keep the speed up.

I do however prefer taller masts, mostly for the benefit of setting larger light air sails.

boatsmith said:

The stock T30 rig was in my opinion too small for the boat. 

never once did we reef. several times in 35-40 apparent wind speed.  

[Zach Johnson]

Boatsmith, would you not use the wingsail again because of its design or because of its size on your boat?

[boatsmith]

I don't like the design