Lenticular sails - Wharram Builders and Friends2024-03-29T09:36:58Zhttp://wharrambuilders.ning.com/forum/topics/lenticular-sails?id=2195841%3ATopic%3A60048&feed=yes&xn_auth=nohey, I think that all the rig…tag:wharrambuilders.ning.com,2017-02-26:2195841:Comment:1494812017-02-26T21:45:41.230Zagur paesüldhttp://wharrambuilders.ning.com/profile/agurpaesueld
<p>hey, I think that all the rig choices will come to this one conclusion:</p>
<p>a) will you go out to water to experiment, if you finally find the time to leave computations</p>
<p>b) will you go out to sail</p>
<p></p>
<p>if your case is b), then it seems reasonably sound to stick with Wharram rig, or just google around ebay and get yourself some beach cat rig, with full battens.</p>
<p>... as there are literally hundreds of Wharram rigs out there sailing around, you might be doing pretty…</p>
<p>hey, I think that all the rig choices will come to this one conclusion:</p>
<p>a) will you go out to water to experiment, if you finally find the time to leave computations</p>
<p>b) will you go out to sail</p>
<p></p>
<p>if your case is b), then it seems reasonably sound to stick with Wharram rig, or just google around ebay and get yourself some beach cat rig, with full battens.</p>
<p>... as there are literally hundreds of Wharram rigs out there sailing around, you might be doing pretty well trusting Old Master in that point... :)</p> Last month in New Zealand I s…tag:wharrambuilders.ning.com,2017-02-17:2195841:Comment:1497532017-02-17T08:28:30.166ZBertrand FERCOThttp://wharrambuilders.ning.com/profile/BertrandFERCOT
<p>Last month in New Zealand I sailed aboard the cat "Oryx" of Peter Hill who has modified his Split Junk Rig with light wishbones to generate good lenticular profiles in using simple flat sails. The rig with its little jib in front of the masts is very well balanced with a good efficiency, easy to reduce quickly the sails. As with the classical Junk Rigs he has a good control of the sails with the sheets connected to the wishbones and so the stress of the sheets is well spread.</p>
<p>Here are…</p>
<p>Last month in New Zealand I sailed aboard the cat "Oryx" of Peter Hill who has modified his Split Junk Rig with light wishbones to generate good lenticular profiles in using simple flat sails. The rig with its little jib in front of the masts is very well balanced with a good efficiency, easy to reduce quickly the sails. As with the classical Junk Rigs he has a good control of the sails with the sheets connected to the wishbones and so the stress of the sheets is well spread.</p>
<p>Here are a few photos:</p>
<p><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930106445?profile=original" target="_self"><img width="721" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930106445?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024" class="align-center" width="721"/></a></p>
<p><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930108095?profile=original" target="_self"><img width="721" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930108095?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024" class="align-center" width="721"/></a></p>
<p><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930110266?profile=original" target="_self"><img width="721" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930110266?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024" class="align-center" width="721"/></a></p>
<p><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930112022?profile=original" target="_self"><img width="721" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930112022?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024" class="align-center" width="721"/></a></p>
<p><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930113836?profile=original" target="_self"><img width="721" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930113836?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024" class="align-center" width="721"/></a></p>
<p><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930115633?profile=original" target="_self"><img width="721" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930115633?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024" class="align-center" width="721"/></a><a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930117302?profile=original" target="_self"><img width="721" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930117302?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024" class="align-center" width="721"/></a>The main advantage comparing with my Swing Wing Rig is that only flat sails are needed instead double sails and it's possible to adjust the curve before to haul up the sail in adjusting the tension of the sail at each wishbone.</p>
<p>Bertrand</p> I believe I read somewhere th…tag:wharrambuilders.ning.com,2017-02-17:2195841:Comment:1496522017-02-17T01:19:31.121ZAlfred Archibald Linthornehttp://wharrambuilders.ning.com/profile/AlfredArchibaldLinthorne
<p>I believe I read somewhere that James Wharram did not think Junkrig Sails are of much use on his desines because of flutter or flapping of the sails causing wear . Since then I have read in an article in the Junkrig assoc about scalloping the edges of the sail to prevent flutter also sewing 3 ply nylon on the edge also reduces this problem any thoughts ? I welcome your input.</p>
<p>I believe I read somewhere that James Wharram did not think Junkrig Sails are of much use on his desines because of flutter or flapping of the sails causing wear . Since then I have read in an article in the Junkrig assoc about scalloping the edges of the sail to prevent flutter also sewing 3 ply nylon on the edge also reduces this problem any thoughts ? I welcome your input.</p> the Hoyt sail is an amazing u…tag:wharrambuilders.ning.com,2011-11-19:2195841:Comment:641902011-11-19T10:13:45.263Zsirfbus1964http://wharrambuilders.ning.com/profile/sirfbus1964
<p>the Hoyt sail is an amazing update of a junk rig even though Garry denies this, the Thick sail is a foil like Bertrand's but with hitec battens the lenticular sail is D shaped, most other sails concentrate on the curved side, the only way I can see it working is if you sail like a Proa and shunt instead of tacking i.e. …<a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930085944?profile=original" target="_self"><img class="align-full" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930085944?profile=original" width="640"></img></a></p>
<p>the Hoyt sail is an amazing update of a junk rig even though Garry denies this, the Thick sail is a foil like Bertrand's but with hitec battens the lenticular sail is D shaped, most other sails concentrate on the curved side, the only way I can see it working is if you sail like a Proa and shunt instead of tacking i.e. <a href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930085944?profile=original" target="_self"><img src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930085944?profile=original" width="640" class="align-full"/></a></p> Here's the page on the sail:…tag:wharrambuilders.ning.com,2011-11-18:2195841:Comment:640912011-11-18T23:20:26.068Zkim whitmyrehttp://wharrambuilders.ning.com/profile/kimwhitmyre
<p><a href="http://www.p28foiler.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/voile21-720x288.jpg" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><img class="align-full" src="http://www.p28foiler.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/voile21-720x288.jpg"></img></a> Here's the page on the sail: <a href="http://www.p28foiler.com/en/the-thick-profile-sail/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">"Thick Sail"</a></p>
<p>It's a "lenticular sail." You made no mention of hull(s). It's very interesting: the "battens" stack as the sail is lowered for reefing. It's very much like Bertrand's tiki 30 sails; he has a picture looking up one of the…</p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://www.p28foiler.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/voile21-720x288.jpg"><img class="align-full" src="http://www.p28foiler.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/voile21-720x288.jpg"/></a>Here's the page on the sail: <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.p28foiler.com/en/the-thick-profile-sail/" target="_blank">"Thick Sail"</a></p>
<p>It's a "lenticular sail." You made no mention of hull(s). It's very interesting: the "battens" stack as the sail is lowered for reefing. It's very much like Bertrand's tiki 30 sails; he has a picture looking up one of the sails that looks very similar.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Mawibo, that does look interesting. . .I have a friend who wants a single mast on his boat in progress. I'll see if he knows about the Hoyt rig.</p>
<p> </p> It's hard to think of a new r…tag:wharrambuilders.ning.com,2011-11-18:2195841:Comment:639922011-11-18T22:35:17.354ZMawibohttp://wharrambuilders.ning.com/profile/Mawibo
<p>It's hard to think of a new revolutionary rig, one can think everything has been done especially with millions of bucks.</p>
<p>Kitesurfer, paragliders could bring something new but my favorite innovation regarding simplicity, balance and ease of reefing has to go to Garry Hoyt's new rig. It is AMAZING and makes a lot of sense.</p>
<p>You can watch a well detailed video here:…</p>
<p></p>
<p>It's hard to think of a new revolutionary rig, one can think everything has been done especially with millions of bucks.</p>
<p>Kitesurfer, paragliders could bring something new but my favorite innovation regarding simplicity, balance and ease of reefing has to go to Garry Hoyt's new rig. It is AMAZING and makes a lot of sense.</p>
<p>You can watch a well detailed video here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.garryhoyt.com/id32.html" target="_blank">http://www.garryhoyt.com/id32.html</a></p>
<p>Here are a few tips...</p>
<p>The gaff stays up.</p>
<p>Nothing is really new but rearranged.</p>
<p>The sails is kept away from the mast.</p>
<p>I wonder how it would work on a multihull but still I find this inspiring.</p>
<p>Tell what you think.</p>
<p> </p>
<p> </p> not much about the sail plus…tag:wharrambuilders.ning.com,2011-11-18:2195841:Comment:638252011-11-18T20:05:08.523Zsirfbus1964http://wharrambuilders.ning.com/profile/sirfbus1964
<p>not much about the sail plus there ain't much space aboard for cruising </p>
<p>not much about the sail plus there ain't much space aboard for cruising </p> Here ya go:
P28foilertag:wharrambuilders.ning.com,2011-11-18:2195841:Comment:639182011-11-18T17:02:39.337Zkim whitmyrehttp://wharrambuilders.ning.com/profile/kimwhitmyre
<p>Here ya go:</p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WalVD5NgNTA" target="_blank"></a></p>
<p><iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/WalVD5NgNTA?wmode=opaque" frameborder="0" height="315" width="560"></iframe>
</p>
<p> </p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.p28foiler.com/en/" target="_blank">P28foiler</a></p>
<p>Here ya go:</p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WalVD5NgNTA" target="_blank"></a></p>
<p><iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/WalVD5NgNTA?wmode=opaque" frameborder="0" height="315" width="560"></iframe>
</p>
<p> </p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.p28foiler.com/en/" target="_blank">P28foiler</a></p> finally I knew you of all peo…tag:wharrambuilders.ning.com,2011-11-10:2195841:Comment:619682011-11-10T22:43:47.508Zsirfbus1964http://wharrambuilders.ning.com/profile/sirfbus1964
<p>finally I knew you of all people would get what i was on about,the only reason the battens bend is so they meet at either end of the sail. It is the cut of the sail that forms your lenticular shape,the tapes either side of the mast restrict the sails so that only one side can move 10%,pulling the other side flat against the mast, giving one curved and one flat side.as the boat tacks the wind flattens the other side and the low pressure pulls the belly to the other side of the mast. </p>
<p>I…</p>
<p>finally I knew you of all people would get what i was on about,the only reason the battens bend is so they meet at either end of the sail. It is the cut of the sail that forms your lenticular shape,the tapes either side of the mast restrict the sails so that only one side can move 10%,pulling the other side flat against the mast, giving one curved and one flat side.as the boat tacks the wind flattens the other side and the low pressure pulls the belly to the other side of the mast. </p>
<p>I knew you were onto the right idea,as my power kite has a flat front and a bowed back,people think they fly because they are airfoil shaped, but the only time they have the airfoil in the wind is when they are "parked" directly overhead the power comes from them deflecting the wind, which they also use to keep their shape,i.e.<a target="_self" href="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930085548?profile=original"><img class="align-center" width="721" src="http://storage.ning.com/topology/rest/1.0/file/get/1930085548?profile=RESIZE_1024x1024"/></a> </p> Thanks Sirfbus1964 for your d…tag:wharrambuilders.ning.com,2011-11-10:2195841:Comment:623892011-11-10T21:25:05.112ZBertrand FERCOThttp://wharrambuilders.ning.com/profile/BertrandFERCOT
<p>Thanks Sirfbus1964 for your drawing.</p>
<p>OK, now I understand, the profile is not generated by the battens but by a belly in each sail and with a such rig you can tack facing the wind. Do you wish to test it on a little boat or a tender?</p>
<p>Perhaps on my next tender (I've to built) I'll test a such double sails with a low rectangular shape as the Viking sail you've put a link but with double wishbones to generate the curve instead a belly in the sails .</p>
<p>Now my masts are built (…</p>
<p>Thanks Sirfbus1964 for your drawing.</p>
<p>OK, now I understand, the profile is not generated by the battens but by a belly in each sail and with a such rig you can tack facing the wind. Do you wish to test it on a little boat or a tender?</p>
<p>Perhaps on my next tender (I've to built) I'll test a such double sails with a low rectangular shape as the Viking sail you've put a link but with double wishbones to generate the curve instead a belly in the sails .</p>
<p>Now my masts are built ( <a href="http://maheyo.free.fr/spip.php?rubrique6" target="_blank">http://maheyo.free.fr/spip.php?rubrique6</a> ), it's time to finalise the design of my double wishbones to built them.</p>
<p>Their profiles will have a deep lenticular shape to be able to generate a powerful sail force without angle of attack......</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Bertrand</p>
<p> </p>
<p> </p>